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Grimdog



Member Since: 08 Sep 2020
Location: Wakefield
Posts: 119

United Kingdom 2010 Freelander 2 TD4_e HSE Manual Barolo Black
Glow Plug Relays and Fuses....It Must Be Getting Cold!

Hi all,

I changed the glow plugs (11v) this autumn, and fitted a new battery ready for winter. 3 out of 4 were dead.

First cold day today (2 degrees ) and the car (2010 TD4 manual) cranked a while before starting in a cloud of white smoke. I tested the new plugs prior to fitting.....All good.

So that leaves ( in the engine bay fuse box ) fuse F1 5A, fuse F4 60A and relay R4 (unless I am missing anything else ).




F1 is OK

F4 I can not access, can anyone help, how on earth does it come out? Identified in the picture below.



Is relay R4 interchangeable with any other relays for testing purposes?

Thanks in anticipation

Richard

Post #415042 25th Nov 2021 2:34 pm
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Geobloke



Member Since: 03 Nov 2018
Location: Anglesey
Posts: 28

Wales 2008 Freelander 2 TD4 HSE Manual Zermatt Silver

Hi. No the glow plug relay is not interchangeable with a standard relay. If you take it out you can easily test the relay with a simple set of test leads and a spare bulb or horn or something.

Post #415066 25th Nov 2021 8:58 pm
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Grimdog



Member Since: 08 Sep 2020
Location: Wakefield
Posts: 119

United Kingdom 2010 Freelander 2 TD4_e HSE Manual Barolo Black

Giobloke, I have all the various multimeter connections, can you please explain further, thanks

Post #415068 26th Nov 2021 12:55 am
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Grimdog



Member Since: 08 Sep 2020
Location: Wakefield
Posts: 119

United Kingdom 2010 Freelander 2 TD4_e HSE Manual Barolo Black

Sorry....Geobloke...predictive text n all.....

Post #415069 26th Nov 2021 1:24 am
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shiggsy



Member Since: 13 Jan 2013
Location: Kent
Posts: 733

United Kingdom 2007 Freelander 2 TD4 HSE Auto Baltic Blue

F3 to F5 might be accessible the same way as F16 to F21 (Fig 10)

Click image to enlarge
 
Hung like Einstein, smart as a horse.

Post #415078 26th Nov 2021 9:57 am
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Geobloke



Member Since: 03 Nov 2018
Location: Anglesey
Posts: 28

Wales 2008 Freelander 2 TD4 HSE Manual Zermatt Silver

Sure thing. The Glow plug relay is a 70 amp relay with bigger terminals tan the standard 30 amp relay we all know and love.

There are many ways to go about testing a relay, using a whole host of bits and pieces. But for a beginner DIYer that may not have a multimeter yet then this is a simple way to test a relay.

To test the relay and any relay all you need is a set test leads with croc clips on the ends (about £3 on amazon) and a 12v bulb. Or if you don't have any of that to hand then you can make up a test rig with an old bulb, I happened to have a spare defender/series side light that I use as a test light, however I have also attached an old horn instead of the light when working in difficult to get places.

Just to prove that this is my test rig. The only thing that is missing are a pair of jump cables which can be useful getting the test gear to where it needs to be. Ultimately it is simple and generally lives in the back of my Defender Rolling Eyes LR life style Rolling Eyes



The reason for the crocodile clips is that the glow plug relays connectors are too big for standard spade connectors. If you do not have test leads or cannot wait for them then I have also used paperclips to hols wires on to hold wires on to terminals before now, only have two hands after all Rolling Eyes

I was going to make this myself but someone else has already done it, basic setup for testing a relay:



Obviously if he relay is working then the light will illuminate, you should also hear a click as the electromagnet engages and brings the contacts together.

The other thing that is worth doing is opening up the really to check the terminals, a small screwdriver is all you need. The reason for doing this is that that contact terminals in the relay can erode and cause intermittent contact or even shorting across the contacts.

This is the glow plug replay on my TD5, it is the same relay as on the Freelander 2. NB: the eroded contacts and smoke staining on the components. Worth checking inside relays as well.





Hope that helps.

Post #415081 26th Nov 2021 10:15 am
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Grimdog



Member Since: 08 Sep 2020
Location: Wakefield
Posts: 119

United Kingdom 2010 Freelander 2 TD4_e HSE Manual Barolo Black

Thanks Shiggsy & Geobloke, both really useful posts, which have helped me move things along this morning.

Firstly, I managed to access the 60A fusable link F4, by removing the sliding cover as shown below. It was really stiff, but eventually gave. The fusable link was good. Tested in situ with my multimeter.







I removed two of the relays R1 and R4 ( the one for the glow plugs). Both appeared identical.







I tested both in the manner described above by Geobloke. Both were good, but swapped them over just in case!

Net result.........no difference at all. Still cranked over for too long and white smoke!

So my conclusion is that the physical parts in the system are ok. Wiring and software could be an issue, and from reading other threads, so could compression and fuel pressure, although the car runs fine, and has no DTC's.

I did find a thread when doing my glow plug research last year, where a guy had very similar problems to myself. He performed all the above ( or had someone do it for him ), but only resolved the issue when the starter motor was changed.

As I am about to change mine ( due to snapping off the solenoid electrical connection when I changed the cam belt last year ), I will update this thread with the outcome. Thanks to all Thumbs Up

Post #415088 26th Nov 2021 11:43 am
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sid



Member Since: 16 Jul 2015
Location: devon
Posts: 357

England 2009 Freelander 2 TD4 HSE Manual Stornoway Grey

before you get too involved chasing a fault,i thought the glow plugs never came on till about minus 4,and thats when you see the glow plug light on dash?my 2007 cranks slightly longer in the cold,but as the engine is direct injection glow plugs are rarely needed.

Post #415102 26th Nov 2021 7:31 pm
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Grimdog



Member Since: 08 Sep 2020
Location: Wakefield
Posts: 119

United Kingdom 2010 Freelander 2 TD4_e HSE Manual Barolo Black

I have looked in vain this morning for a post from Alex, which showed a chart indicating the duration of the glow plug illumination relative to time and temperature. IIRC the glow plug illumination commenced around + 3 or 4 degrees, with a cranking time of 1.5 seconds, getting progressively longer as the temperatures dropped.
Most glow plug threads on here indicate that when the plugs have been changed, there have been multiple plugs inoperative, suggesting that they do a fair amount of work?
3 out of 4 of mine were dead, but the starting appears not to have improved. This leads me to think the problem lies elsewhere.

Post #415114 27th Nov 2021 8:03 am
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shiggsy



Member Since: 13 Jan 2013
Location: Kent
Posts: 733

United Kingdom 2007 Freelander 2 TD4 HSE Auto Baltic Blue

Here you go:

https://www.freel2.com/gallery/albums/userpics/11383/glows.pdf 
Hung like Einstein, smart as a horse.

Post #415118 27th Nov 2021 9:52 am
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Grimdog



Member Since: 08 Sep 2020
Location: Wakefield
Posts: 119

United Kingdom 2010 Freelander 2 TD4_e HSE Manual Barolo Black

Well done Shiggsy.........could have saved myself re-reading countless cold start \ glow plug threads this morning!

Post #415123 27th Nov 2021 12:32 pm
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shiggsy



Member Since: 13 Jan 2013
Location: Kent
Posts: 733

United Kingdom 2007 Freelander 2 TD4 HSE Auto Baltic Blue

I have to ask, I can't make out what surface this is on? It looks like you chucked it in a river Smile (hope it's not your bonnet Embarassed ).

 
Hung like Einstein, smart as a horse.

Post #415134 27th Nov 2021 3:59 pm
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Grimdog



Member Since: 08 Sep 2020
Location: Wakefield
Posts: 119

United Kingdom 2010 Freelander 2 TD4_e HSE Manual Barolo Black

Haha......it's an outdoor glass topped dining table......flat on the top, but textured on the underside.....

Post #415141 27th Nov 2021 5:01 pm
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