dorsetfreelander wrote:

Yes, what happens to JLR's new engine plant in Wolverhampton given that they will have to stop selling cars with IC engines in 2040? In practice this means that well before that date people will start choosing cars with electric drive so I wonder how many years it takes to recoup the £500m investment in that plant? That business plan might look a bit of a dud now.

Box ticking. Government has had to comply with having a policy to curb high pollution from the internal combustion engine.

Job Done, but not well done ! its ticked the box that 's all. The pressure will now mount on the the local big city councils to deliver. FL2 MY10 TD4 GS traded in at 2 years
FL2 MY13 TD4 GS Current

MartynB wrote:

dorsetfreelander wrote:

Yes, what happens to JLR's new engine plant in Wolverhampton given that they will have to stop selling cars with IC engines in 2040? In practice this means that well before that date people will start choosing cars with electric drive so I wonder how many years it takes to recoup the £500m investment in that plant? That business plan might look a bit of a dud now.

I suspect what we will see is the same engines with Hybrid capability, there is no way that the UK can have a full electric vehicle infrastructure in 23 years. A bigger threat to all that investment will be the ability to keep punting out high cost high spec vehicles on the back of low finance PCP deals using fake residual values for GFV. When that lot goes pop as it will do , perhaps coupled with timing on tariffs to move exports to the mainland they might start getting a little worried.

No.18 on the list is wrong, Bilstein dampers from Romania assemble into modules in the UK, well for the next year or so before Discovery production moves to Slovakia for 19MY.

Old fashioned possibly but I have avoided personal leasing, I am not a fan and would steer people away as once locked in I feel its hard to escape, be it any future contract or a particular brand.

Martyn is correct about it going to go pop at some stage. The Country is awash with used cars and new cars are stacked up on old airfields etc inside and outside UK. Interest rates are going one way only and carp is certainly gong to hit that fan.

Oh and am I the only person in this Country who was not mis-sold PPI ? Why on earth are Banks still making new provision for this ?  FL2 MY10 TD4 GS traded in at 2 years
FL2 MY13 TD4 GS Current

norfie wrote:

No.18 on the list is wrong, Bilstein dampers from Romania assemble into modules in the UK, well for the next year or so before Discovery production moves to Slovakia for 19MY.

Both

They had the boss of Pendragon on Radio 4 this morning, apparently they run about 200 dealerships. He said that over 90% of new cars are sold on PCP now and went on about how it makes sense to Lease a depreciating asset so that you are only paying for the depreciation rather than buy it.
In the past I have always preferred to buy with cash but when I bought my latest FL2 I got a better deal by having some finance on it so I did some cash and some finance. I now pay £206/ month out of my pension rather than raid my capital. For me it made sense. 3 x FL1 2 manual + 1 auto
5 x FL2 4 manual + 1 auto
Now Discovery Sport P250 MHEV SE

Guy in this village with the probably largest home with indoor pool etc bought the detached house behind I assume to get even more privacy, now bought a 15 bed manor house with land elsewhere for several million (I am told cash). Involved with large car leasing company at board level. Hope he does not fall out with the wife as that will be an expensive day out.

Yes, I bet they can't wait to sign up everyone for leasing being so good for the customer.  FL2 MY10 TD4 GS traded in at 2 years
FL2 MY13 TD4 GS Current

The difference here is that property doesn't depreciate as much as cars do but I bet he doesn't buy his car with cash. There is some debate in the Financial Times currently about who is actually carrying the risks on PCP and it seems to be a mixture of the banks and manufacturers as it has the makings of another sub-prime mortgage scam that kicked off the 2008/9 problems. The difference here is that the end user can walk away which you can't do with a house. The dealers and finance houses are just acting as middle men selling loans which will be backed off to the banks, which is why I don't own any bank shares any more. 3 x FL1 2 manual + 1 auto
5 x FL2 4 manual + 1 auto
Now Discovery Sport P250 MHEV SE

Warren Buffet - " if it a appreciates - own it , if it depreciates lease it " . Very sound advice from the best

Per se there is nothing wrong with PCP when you have the funds to make oppportunity decisions .Under the right circumstances I would lease, but those circumstances have to be right for the individual at the time of acquisition , not the first and only route. The industry is cynical in pushing people down this as the first route.

The issue with PCP in the UK is the vast number of people merrily driving around in their new high spec junior exec motor who don't get the reality that if the GFV offered by the dealers doesn't materialise in 2019 after the 2016 bonanza sales , they won't get the chance to trade up without putting extra cash in, they will walk away and have as we say up here " nowt ". Where as they could be owning a 3 year old fully paid up Ford.

. The industry has been Cavalier ( no pun ! ) selling dreams and raking in bonuses on finance. No wonder the forecourts of the dealers are piled high with second hand high spec 12 month old cars as folks find out that paying £400 a month from their salary on top of the 5 grand deposit paid was not sustainable. Yes the banks carry the risk, but when it goes pear shaped as it will, which car manufacturers are best placed to ride it out, those with a range of vehicles starting at 10k or those whose vehicles start at 30k ? 2009 GS Auto Zermatt Silver - Sold June 21 after 10 years of ownership

2016 Subaru Outback SE 2.0 diesel SE Premium Lineartronic Sold 2024 after 8 years and 80k miles . Best Car I ever owned !

2023 Toyota Hilux invincible X 2.8 Auto .

Interesting article in Financial Times today about who makes most money out of making cars and the answer seems to be the component suppliers. This is ironic since the manufacturers effectively outsourced component supply years ago. The big manufacturers spend megabucks on advertising to keep their brands up there and suppliers spend hardly anything apart from visiting a few trade shows. In addition the component suppliers are calling the shots on pricing. It's the old story that the people who make the money in a gold rush are the folks selling picks and shovels and not the gold miners.
The expectation is that as cars become replaced by ride sharing or self driving vehicles and the likes of Uber then people care less about what they drive in (eg did you care what sort of plane you flew in last time) and the value added in a car becomes the fancy electronics which are not produced by the car makers. Makes you wonder where all this is going especially since fewer young people are learning to drive now. 3 x FL1 2 manual + 1 auto
5 x FL2 4 manual + 1 auto
Now Discovery Sport P250 MHEV SE

The biggest problem for the car industry is that lower & lower percentages of the next generations are simply not getting their drivers licences', this has a knock on effect.

This has been happening for a decade. It is the cost, city living, running a car... more so if your future is casual work, running a car is very expensive. The entire car industry & government has by the back door shot themselves in both feet & stopped the next generation buying cars.

It does not matter how many pointless electronic computer controlled gadgets you stuff into a car. The next generation priorities have well & truly shifted! & the tax revenue for governments will accordingly be an issue as well. They will start heavily taxing electric wheel chairs!

I can see my own situation, I don't really need a car, but because I am "old" & that it was the custom of my generation to have a car, it basically sits in the garage most of the time! Procrastination, mankind's greatest labour saving device!

Acoustic insulation ARB TPMS 3xARB air compressors After cooler Air tank On-board OCD pressure air/water cleaning Additional 50L fuel Carpet in doors ABE 2x1kg Waeco 28L modified fridge Battery 4x26ah Solar 120w Victron MPPT 100/20 DC-DC 18amps 175amp jumper plug Awning 6x255/60R18

dorsetfreelander wrote:

the people who make the money in a gold rush are the folks selling picks and shovels and not the gold miners.

excellent point, quality food is essential, so buy British Chicken At work
At home

"I can't always believe facts I read on the web" - Charles Dickens

winner by default of the tractor vs caravan race