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Tim in Scotland



Member Since: 12 Mar 2006
Location: All at sea
Posts: 875

United Kingdom 

Sounds like a "non-fuel burning" version of the Fuel Burning Heater fitted to the bigger engined diesels in the RRS/D3 and FFRR.
Modern diesels have engine blocks made from very high carbon content steel and are so thermally efficient for emissions that it takes ages for the heater to get warm enough air for heating the cabin so a diesel powered back-up heater is fitted. On early D3's there was a built in timer system so you could preheat the cabin on cold mornings that was supposed to be a cost option but somehow every car got it for free. LR solved that by doing an ECU downgrade that removed the option at the first visit to a dealer and as mentioned by countrywide elsewhere early D3's had lots and lots of visits to the dealers to cure glitches!
BTW the high carbon content doesn't just impact on the heating - its one of the reasons why you have to check your engine oil level very carefully when the car is new as the carbon block absorbs the engine oil.............. How can carbon have a footprint, it has no feet?
Now driving - RRE Coupe Dynamic Lux Auto with Plus pack, Fuji White, Ebony, SD4 with tow pack
Gone - 2010MY FFRR TDv8 Stornoway and Ivory, Privacy - the pace of a TDv8 RRS, the incomparable grace of a Range Rover
Gone but will be missed- RRS Tdv8 HSE Stornoway Grey with Ebony Leather
Gone (only a little missed) RRS Tdv6 2.7SE Giverny Green/Aspen
Defender 90 County HT in Epsom Green

Post #27112 11th Sep 2008 7:59 am
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John L



Member Since: 07 Jul 2007
Location: The Garden of England
Posts: 182

United Kingdom 

John L wrote:
Mine is in on Thursday to have the Transmission fault reduced traction issue seen to. I will ask about this while it is in and let you all know if I find out anything.


Fair play to the dealers-it was automatically booked to have the recall done. I believe it has simply been disconnected possibly pending further instructions. Hopefully we should start getting updates in due course.

Post #27139 11th Sep 2008 5:51 pm
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HC001



Member Since: 08 Mar 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 12

Tim - The real reason why the diesels do not provide adequate amount of heat to the cabin heat exchanger is more down to poor coolant flow design, not that the engines are super efficient.

Post #27223 12th Sep 2008 11:16 pm
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chicken george



Member Since: 05 Dec 2007
Location: N. Yorks
Posts: 13289

United Kingdom 2008 Freelander 2 TD4 XS Manual Santorini Black

HC001 wrote:
Tim - The real reason why the diesels do not provide adequate amount of heat to the cabin heat exchanger is more down to poor coolant flow design, not that the engines are super efficient.


who? what? why? where? diesels takes ages to warm up with or without coolant problems! At work
At home

"I can't always believe facts I read on the web" - Charles Dickens

winner by default of the tractor vs caravan race

Post #27228 12th Sep 2008 11:35 pm
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upnaway



Member Since: 15 Nov 2007
Location: Worcestershire
Posts: 258

United Kingdom 2007 Freelander 2 TD4 SE Manual Baltic Blue

Diesels are intrinsically more efficient in converting fuel into power hence less fuel gets converted into waste heat which would need to be absorbed by the cooling system. Since your heater is effectively just another radiator plumbed into the cooling system due to the lower temperature which diesels need to run at efficiently they have always had a problem providing sufficient heat to provide satisfactory heater performance especially on start up. Hence the fitment of supplementary heater systems. still pining for my 3dr, no removeable hardtop, no drop glass tailgate, no roof rack, no pockets everywhere to stow all that man kit

Post #27280 13th Sep 2008 7:10 pm
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phil_wkl



Member Since: 01 Mar 2008
Location: Sydney, NSW
Posts: 369

Australia 

So when do I get my recall letter? Phil

Post #27289 13th Sep 2008 9:27 pm
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chicken george



Member Since: 05 Dec 2007
Location: N. Yorks
Posts: 13289

United Kingdom 2008 Freelander 2 TD4 XS Manual Santorini Black

phil_wkl wrote:
So when do I get my recall letter?


After the all the V.I.P black cars have been sorted out Whistle At work
At home

"I can't always believe facts I read on the web" - Charles Dickens

winner by default of the tractor vs caravan race

Post #27291 13th Sep 2008 10:10 pm
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joe1978



Member Since: 27 Jun 2007
Location: North East England
Posts: 201

United Kingdom 2011 Freelander 2 TD4 GS Manual Fuji White

Meant to get back to you sooner but...

10 min job to take fuse out done on Friday, nice folk but the revised part won't be avialable until the end of the year so I've been told. MY11 Fuji white Td4 150 GS straight up no mixer.

Post #27445 15th Sep 2008 8:44 pm
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phil_wkl



Member Since: 01 Mar 2008
Location: Sydney, NSW
Posts: 369

Australia 

So what's the effect? no heat? be a Censored in winter... Phil

Post #27501 16th Sep 2008 2:20 pm
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Chris B



Member Since: 23 Jul 2008
Location: North Yorkshire
Posts: 440

United Kingdom 

If this is the AUXILLIARY heater, then it's not the cabin heater but the fuel powered burner that pre-heats the Td4 coolant so that engine and passenger heater get faster warm up in cold climates.

The very clever systems, on Mercedes and the like, come on before you get to the car (can be set on a timer) so that the coolant is warm or hot before you start the engine, plus instant heater!

My neighbour got this on his FL1 as part of a winter pack. Apparently is virtually standard in Scandinavia.

If this is the case, then only a small minority of FL2s in UK will be affected. I don't think it's fitted to I6 because the petrol engine has a higher heat rejection to water and warms up faster anyway.

IF it is a recall it should be on the VOSA site and notified to all dealers but not to ALL owners as LR will know which chassis numbers have this level of equipment.

It won't be me - I have not got one (my winter pack is bi-Xenon lights, heated screen, seats and washer jets)

Chris Gone... 2013 XS TD4 Manual Firenze Red
Gone... 2008 (09MY) XS Td4 Manual Stornaway Grey
Prior... 2003 G4 Discovery 2, 1998 Disco 1 and 1997 Disco 1 Company car before that
Also gone in Nov'13, after 7.5 yrs, to new owners with time for more TLC - 1980 Series III 88
Current 2015 Discovery Sport HSE 2.0

Post #27602 17th Sep 2008 1:54 pm
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Dave



Member Since: 04 Jul 2007
Location: Somewhere Near You
Posts: 2666

Scotland 2012 Freelander 2 SD4 HSE Auto Indus Silver

If it's the fuel powered burner then I wouldn't think that it is subject to condensation and shorting out with a potential for causing a fire (as written in the original post).

Checked today and still nothing on the VOSA website so I'll just sit tight and wait for T&C in Aberdeen to contact me. But knowing the speed they work at I might well have a BBQ before I hear anything Evil or Very Mad ______________________
2011 Full Fat RR 4.4 TDV8
2012 FL2 SD4 Auto HSE
2013 Kawasaki Versys 650

Post #27606 17th Sep 2008 2:05 pm
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phil_wkl



Member Since: 01 Mar 2008
Location: Sydney, NSW
Posts: 369

Australia 

Confused are you saying its an option or standard for TD4 in the UK? Phil

Post #27619 17th Sep 2008 4:33 pm
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Dave



Member Since: 04 Jul 2007
Location: Somewhere Near You
Posts: 2666

Scotland 2012 Freelander 2 SD4 HSE Auto Indus Silver

I think it's standard equipment. If you press the "Program" button, that turns on the heated windows and mirrors and also you start to get warm air coming through quite quickly on the windscreen to demist/defrost it so i guess it's and electric heater we are talking about here.

I think a phone call to the dealer might be in order to confirm this. ______________________
2011 Full Fat RR 4.4 TDV8
2012 FL2 SD4 Auto HSE
2013 Kawasaki Versys 650

Post #27620 17th Sep 2008 5:30 pm
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npinks



Member Since: 28 Jun 2007
Location: Ls25
Posts: 20090

United Kingdom 

i phoned my dealer and asked about it, when booking the car in for its service

Didn't know anything about it, still looking into it I presume Rolling Eyes Former Mod/Member, with the most post & Chicken George Arch nemesis

Post #27627 17th Sep 2008 6:59 pm
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upnaway



Member Since: 15 Nov 2007
Location: Worcestershire
Posts: 258

United Kingdom 2007 Freelander 2 TD4 SE Manual Baltic Blue

Supect that there might be 3 different fitment levels, petrol and sunny climes, no auxillary cabin heater fitted, temperate regions, PTC heater which due too its obviously high electrical drain would be susceptable to condensation tracking and last but not least the brass monkey regions where you could imagine a fully fledged fuel burner being required.
None of the above are coolant heaters which is a whole new subject.
One of my M47 powered 3drs had a fuel burner fitted which puffed and blew all to itself and was very effective, on my 2nd M47 F/L1 none of the tell tale signs where there and I accussed stealer of down specing and got said tale about these 'magical' electrical heaters. still pining for my 3dr, no removeable hardtop, no drop glass tailgate, no roof rack, no pockets everywhere to stow all that man kit

Post #27632 17th Sep 2008 8:26 pm
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