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Home > General > FL2 Intermittent Tail Light problem, N/S Passenger side
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notwen



Member Since: 29 Jul 2021
Location: Cheshire
Posts: 26

United Kingdom 2007 Freelander 2 TD4 XS Manual Tambora Flame

Hi Nodge, and others who have replied.

I'd been away for a week or so,....so hadn't had chance to troubleshoot any further until last weekend. I tried swapping the O/S light cluster plugged in to the N/S plug......and the taillights on this didn't work either? So any ideas where this takes me? Can we assume the fault is not in the light binnacle now? (I was kinda hoping it would be TBH........as this now means the fault is within the vehicle elsewhere - pointing towards the CJB/ FET controller Sad Any ideas guys....as pulling my hair out now, and its darker nights Sad Current Vehicles:
2007 Freelander 2 - XS Tabora Flame TD4
1989 Range-Rover Vogue SE V8 3.9 Petrol/LPG
1976 Land-Rover SIII SWB 88 County, 2.25l Petrol/LPG
Past vehicles:
1999 Range-Rover P38 V8 4.0 - Money pit
1988 Range-Rover V8 3.9

Post #437057 14th Nov 2023 10:40 pm
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notwen



Member Since: 29 Jul 2021
Location: Cheshire
Posts: 26

United Kingdom 2007 Freelander 2 TD4 XS Manual Tambora Flame

Hi Nodge, I'm still pulling my hair out with this prob with the N/S Tail light. Any ideas? Ive tried plugging the Drivers side lamp unit into the O/S plug/skt......and same issue. So I dont think the problem is an LED cluster, or problem within the lamp binnacle/unit. Would you agree?
plug connectors etc all appear to be clean and secure.
So do I have a problem with the CJB / FETs control module?.......and how would I go about sorting thing?
Many thanks, John Current Vehicles:
2007 Freelander 2 - XS Tabora Flame TD4
1989 Range-Rover Vogue SE V8 3.9 Petrol/LPG
1976 Land-Rover SIII SWB 88 County, 2.25l Petrol/LPG
Past vehicles:
1999 Range-Rover P38 V8 4.0 - Money pit
1988 Range-Rover V8 3.9

Post #437409 29th Nov 2023 11:38 pm
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Nodge68



Member Since: 15 Jul 2020
Location: Newquay
Posts: 1839

United Kingdom 2009 Freelander 2 TD4 SE Manual Rimini Red

Have you measured the voltage for the lights? Or maybe connected a test light?
What year is the vehicle? You mentioned LEDs so I'm guessing it's a facelift, but it could be an early with retrofitted LED lights?

If the latter, then the FETs are designed to supply power to proper bulbs, so LEDs can cause permanent issues with the BCM.

Here is what happens. The BCM has what are called Field Effect Transistors (FET) internal to the module which are used for things such as lighting. These FETs are able to turn current on and off and measure the amperage on the circuit. If the amperage is too high (short to ground) or too low (open), the BCM will disable the output and set a DTC.

When you have LEDs installed, the BCM sees low amperage at all times. Since there is still some amperage being consumed, the circuit is not disabled. However, the BCM will set a DTC indicating that the amperage is low on the circuit. The BCM can only set a particular DTC for an FET a certain number (hundreds) of times before the module will disable the FET and make the code permanent. This failure mode normally requires module replacement.

The bottom line is that you installed an aftermarket component that does not meet OEM specifications for the year of manufacture, and it resulted in a failure of the module. That is not the fault of the manufacture, it's the way the module has been used.
I would caution anyone against using non-factory bulbs in any circuit that is controlled by an FET; the same result will eventually occur. 2009 Rimini Red SE TD4. Soon to be sold.
Hyundai Ioniq 5 Ultimate on order.
Gone. 2006 Tonga Green i6 HSE.

Post #437412 30th Nov 2023 8:40 am
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notwen



Member Since: 29 Jul 2021
Location: Cheshire
Posts: 26

United Kingdom 2007 Freelander 2 TD4 XS Manual Tambora Flame

Hi Nodge, Thanks for your reply.
The FL2 is a 2007 model - so yes, had standard filament bulbs fitted - but I retro fitted aftermarket LED lamp units sold by PowerfulUK that were aimed at upgrading earlier models to the later 'look'.

So in the back of the lamp units there are a couple of ballast resistors that are probably to trick BCM?

I've tried plugging the lamp unit in from the drivers side and same, same.
So do you think is a FET problem?
I guess in the event of this, is it replace the BCM? and where even is it? Is it buried up above the passenger side footwell area?
Many thanks, John Current Vehicles:
2007 Freelander 2 - XS Tabora Flame TD4
1989 Range-Rover Vogue SE V8 3.9 Petrol/LPG
1976 Land-Rover SIII SWB 88 County, 2.25l Petrol/LPG
Past vehicles:
1999 Range-Rover P38 V8 4.0 - Money pit
1988 Range-Rover V8 3.9

Post #437432 30th Nov 2023 2:25 pm
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Nodge68



Member Since: 15 Jul 2020
Location: Newquay
Posts: 1839

United Kingdom 2009 Freelander 2 TD4 SE Manual Rimini Red

First off have you read the codes from the CJB (BCM)?
If so what are they?

I'm assuming the resistors supplied with the lights are the load resistors for the indicators to trick the CJB into flashing them at the correct speed.
The same trick can be used for all LEDs where normal bulbs were originally fitted, however is the CJB has locked out that output, it's too late I suspect, unless there's a code that it allows to be cleared, but that's not always the case. 2009 Rimini Red SE TD4. Soon to be sold.
Hyundai Ioniq 5 Ultimate on order.
Gone. 2006 Tonga Green i6 HSE.

Post #437443 30th Nov 2023 11:20 pm
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notwen



Member Since: 29 Jul 2021
Location: Cheshire
Posts: 26

United Kingdom 2007 Freelander 2 TD4 XS Manual Tambora Flame

Hi Nodge, Thanks for you feedback. Yes, I have got an OBD reader - mines an AUTEL AutoLink AL419 - but when I hook it up to the vehicle it only seems to read engine/ emissions related trouble codes.
Is it possible this OBD reader doesnt tap down into other systems such as the CJB or BECMs?

Can you recommend a diagnostic reader that you use for troubleshoot the kind of issues I'm having?

If the particular FET in question is f*cked.....is the CJB a bin job, and needs replacing?

I've seen on some other posts/ forums about doing a 'hard reset' whereby you disconnect the battery leads and short them together to reset all the control modules. Would this do anything for me?
And if doing so, what codes would I loose?........Radio, Alarm etc.

(on my previous P38......after disconnecting the battery was always a nightmare!......Alarm/BECM, Radio, Reset windows/Sunroof etc......nightmare!)

Any advise you can point me towards would be much appreciated - thanks.

Regards, John Current Vehicles:
2007 Freelander 2 - XS Tabora Flame TD4
1989 Range-Rover Vogue SE V8 3.9 Petrol/LPG
1976 Land-Rover SIII SWB 88 County, 2.25l Petrol/LPG
Past vehicles:
1999 Range-Rover P38 V8 4.0 - Money pit
1988 Range-Rover V8 3.9

Post #437587 7th Dec 2023 12:14 am
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Nodge68



Member Since: 15 Jul 2020
Location: Newquay
Posts: 1839

United Kingdom 2009 Freelander 2 TD4 SE Manual Rimini Red

You could try a hard reset to see if it fixes anything. From memory though, a FoMoCo BCM will permanently lock out an erroneous output after a while. The FETs are normally fine, it's the ASIC (micro controller) which controls the FET that has cut the output. You could use a more advanced diagnostic tool (one that reads all systems) to see if there are any codes that can be cleared.

My daughter's Fiat 500 number plate light supply has done the same, although for a different reason. On hers the harness suffered damage where it goes between the body and hatch. This causes a high resistance connection to the number plate light which the BCM flagged as a serious fault and shut the output down. I can't clear the fault, even with Fiat diagnostic gear, so I've simply linked the number plate light to the tail light supply.

Unfortunately these car electronics systems are too clever for their own good. 2009 Rimini Red SE TD4. Soon to be sold.
Hyundai Ioniq 5 Ultimate on order.
Gone. 2006 Tonga Green i6 HSE.

Post #437650 8th Dec 2023 10:06 pm
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notwen



Member Since: 29 Jul 2021
Location: Cheshire
Posts: 26

United Kingdom 2007 Freelander 2 TD4 XS Manual Tambora Flame

Hi Nodge, As ever, many thanks for your feedback. I had 'toyed' with the idea of what about if I piggybacked a connection from the O/S taillight over to the N/s one.....but then worried that I might overload the FET thats driving the O/S? Current Vehicles:
2007 Freelander 2 - XS Tabora Flame TD4
1989 Range-Rover Vogue SE V8 3.9 Petrol/LPG
1976 Land-Rover SIII SWB 88 County, 2.25l Petrol/LPG
Past vehicles:
1999 Range-Rover P38 V8 4.0 - Money pit
1988 Range-Rover V8 3.9

Post #437656 9th Dec 2023 10:30 am
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Nodge68



Member Since: 15 Jul 2020
Location: Newquay
Posts: 1839

United Kingdom 2009 Freelander 2 TD4 SE Manual Rimini Red

If you're still running LED tail lights, then there's no way you'll overload the FETs. These issues can occur because the FET isn't seeing enough current (LEDs use about ⅛ the power of a standard bulb), but some current is flowing, just not enough to keep the system happy.
If it were nine, I'd cut the wire which isn't supplying any power and tape the end to prevent shorts, then run a jumper wire from the tail light on the other side. I'd probably add a 100 Ohm resistor between the tail light supply and ground too (it needs to be a power resistor) which will put about 2 Watts of load on the circuit, which is enough when combined with the LED tail lights to trick the BCM that it's powering a conventional bulb. You could measure the power drain of the LED tail lights so you can size a load resistor exactly, if you want to be really accurate on what load the BCM FET is seeing. 2009 Rimini Red SE TD4. Soon to be sold.
Hyundai Ioniq 5 Ultimate on order.
Gone. 2006 Tonga Green i6 HSE.

Post #437660 9th Dec 2023 12:48 pm
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Bobupndown



Member Since: 26 Dec 2014
Location: Upside down behind the TV!
Posts: 2653

United Kingdom 2014 Freelander 2 SD4 GS Auto Orkney Grey

Have you tried refitting the original tail light with standard bulbs temporarily to see if any problems occur with it?
It might just be the aftermarket lamps failing. Landrover - turning owners into mechanics since 1948

2014 Orkney grey Freelander SD4 GS.
2004 Zambezi silver Discovery 2 Td5 (Gone)
1963 Surf blue Morris Mini Minor Super de Luxe (my little toy)

Post #437663 9th Dec 2023 2:01 pm
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notwen



Member Since: 29 Jul 2021
Location: Cheshire
Posts: 26

United Kingdom 2007 Freelander 2 TD4 XS Manual Tambora Flame

Unfortunately I sold the originals Sad But must admit I had wondered about that? Might look for a used one on ebay - to enable this check Current Vehicles:
2007 Freelander 2 - XS Tabora Flame TD4
1989 Range-Rover Vogue SE V8 3.9 Petrol/LPG
1976 Land-Rover SIII SWB 88 County, 2.25l Petrol/LPG
Past vehicles:
1999 Range-Rover P38 V8 4.0 - Money pit
1988 Range-Rover V8 3.9

Post #437723 11th Dec 2023 10:36 pm
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AndyP



Member Since: 09 May 2007
Location: Reading
Posts: 97

United Kingdom 2007 Freelander 2 TD4 GS Manual Sumatra Black

Funnily enough , similar problem with my cluster today. RH side fail. Not the bulb. In the course of debug to make sure it wasn't the bulb, swapped bulbs left & right ... with the power still on . i.e. the LH side illuminated.
Clearly, the FET sense driver circuits are sensitive. At one stage the working LH would only illuminate if the non work RH side had a bulb in and the sense circuit complete!
My scanner didn't list the Rear Control module, but I think it is probably Headlamp Control Module , but it wouldn't scan.
Now I had a number of other fault codes in various modules and wait for it ......

This problem occurred after a really cold start resulting in the 'normal' slew of HDC errors after an extended crank voltage drop.

Ignition on /off no change
Ignition off , double lock , coffee pause , unlock , ignition on .. bingo all back working again.
So more of the soft reset , i.e the system quickly goes into deep sleep mode after the double lock.

Post #438321 10th Jan 2024 12:59 pm
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notwen



Member Since: 29 Jul 2021
Location: Cheshire
Posts: 26

United Kingdom 2007 Freelander 2 TD4 XS Manual Tambora Flame

Hi Andy, Thanks for your reply. I tried your method - but mines still the same unfortunately. Really pulling my hair out with this one.....and what with an MOT looming in March, I need to get to the bottom of it fast Big Cry Current Vehicles:
2007 Freelander 2 - XS Tabora Flame TD4
1989 Range-Rover Vogue SE V8 3.9 Petrol/LPG
1976 Land-Rover SIII SWB 88 County, 2.25l Petrol/LPG
Past vehicles:
1999 Range-Rover P38 V8 4.0 - Money pit
1988 Range-Rover V8 3.9

Post #438359 11th Jan 2024 10:28 pm
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notwen



Member Since: 29 Jul 2021
Location: Cheshire
Posts: 26

United Kingdom 2007 Freelander 2 TD4 XS Manual Tambora Flame

Hi Nodge. I'm still pulling my hair out with this taillight issue unfortunately. I was looking at it again today - with a view to linking across from the RH taillight to the LH taillight as you'd suggested but struggled to identify which wire I would piggy back off. On these LED lamp units there are 3 wires going to the Taillight (with combined brake light) - a Red, a Green and a Black. The Green and the Black have a 220ohm resistor across. (and i'm guessing as these are after market lamps - those core colours probably have no relevance to the OEM wiring loom. But with a meter I tried looking for voltages at the grey multipin socket (on the vehicle side) and on the pins that appear to match up with where the red,blk, green go on the other side appeared to have 12V on them (even with the lights switched off). Is this right? So by getting a reading on all three pins of the multi connector I wasnt confident that just by tracing the colours of the wires through I was identifying the correct wires for the RH tailight.
Would you, or anybody else on here know the 'pinout' of the grey multi-pin sockets for the tail lights? Current Vehicles:
2007 Freelander 2 - XS Tabora Flame TD4
1989 Range-Rover Vogue SE V8 3.9 Petrol/LPG
1976 Land-Rover SIII SWB 88 County, 2.25l Petrol/LPG
Past vehicles:
1999 Range-Rover P38 V8 4.0 - Money pit
1988 Range-Rover V8 3.9

Post #438360 11th Jan 2024 10:41 pm
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Badger51



Member Since: 01 Mar 2014
Location: Coffs Harbour
Posts: 918

Australia 

You can download the manuals here:

https://www.freel2.com/forum/topic10621.html (Now Sold). 2008 Freelander 2 (Nazca Sand) SE TD4 Auto. Statutory write off & on WOVR for hail damage but still road legal.
171037Km as of 09/05/22
Superchips Bluefin Flash
Nanocom Evo II (also sold)

Post #438364 12th Jan 2024 6:32 am
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