Hi all

Having absolutely nightmare with my car for last couple months, intermittent starting problem.
This is video of not starting at the moment:

https://youtu.be/sqLR4g12jY4

Started very similar like problem in this thread (second video)
http://www.freel2.com/forum/topic28516.htm...dy+control
I my case needle jumping up and down when revs are quickly going down when driving, during gear change or hard braking.
Specially at lower speed or when reversing.
No problems when idling or revving up stationary but when i select a reverse, leave the handbrake on and start to release the clutch temp gauge will jump up and down and errors will come up.
When temp needle is up OBDC port not responding , can't check errors. Also steering wheel not locking.

Second earth mode done, checked Body Control Module connections, A pillar plugs, battery ok, starter motor solenoid replaced, crank sensor replaced, yaw sensors replaced.

Yesterday I filled up at petrol station, car started and all errors come up, temp gauge up and stayed there. Got home switched engine off and I couldn't start again.

Is there sort of fuel sensor before the HP pump?

thank you

Last edited by lesiu30 on 25th Mar 2018 7:10 pm. Edited 1 time in total

Also when temp gauge jumps, revs counter drops to zero, and external temp not showing

Have you tried a hard reset it sometime cures a lot of electrical faults. Remove your battery terminals from the battery and touch them together for a few seconds then reconnect them and try starting your engine again. Understeer when you hit the wall with the front of the car.
Oversteer when you hit the wall with the back of the car.
Horsepower how fast you hit the wall.
Torque how far you take the wall with you.

Tried many times, no change, new battery also.
Last month I had exactly the same problem. I called breakdown assistance, he started checking all connections inside engine bay and after he moved earth strap from body to gearbox, car started. I bought new, replaced, no problem for a week. Now is back again. Attached jump lead to negative and connected to various places in engine bay, no luck.
Suspecting dodgy sensor or connector but where?
What are the 2 sensors on the gearbox?

Thank you

All I can suggest is to put a code reader on it

Port is not responding when temp gauge is up. 2 weeks ago when gauge was jumping up and down I connected reader and these errors come up:

P0380 Glow plug control circuit
P0564 Speed control multi-function input A circuit
P0833 Clutch pedal switch B circuit
P193B Throttle/pedal signal
U0300 Internal control module software incompatibility
U0415 Invalid data received from ABS control module

Temp gauge only jumps when car is moving, in neutral or gear, no difference. When I tap the brakes hard, needle will jump. When I reduce the gears hard from 2nd to 1st without touching the brakes, needle will jump. Absolutely crazy problem.
Thank you

So every time you move off or stop the vehicle the temp gauge re-acts ?

I would then expect it to be a connector or connector block shorting across with movement and be looking initially for one not far from your feet or steering wheel. Needle in a haystack job and a highly qualified auto electrician may be the best course of action.

These sort of events are always going to be the death of the FL2 as the fleet get older and fault finding time becomes excessively expensive. You are doing the right thing in asking but equally if not more important when you cure it tell us what was the curse you had. FL2 MY10 TD4 GS traded in at 2 years
FL2 MY13 TD4 GS Current

No when I move off, I can accelerate as hard I want and nothing happens. It happens specifically on low speed when revs are dropping like slow traffic or breaking before the lights. Mostly when the revs needle is almost at idle speed. And only when car moving.
2 weeks ago I couldn't start, was just clicking sound. I reset the errors and the engine fired. I know the symptoms sound like dodgy connections around steering wheel but why it fired after clearing errors?
I think is maybe fuel starvation or something to do with alternator?
I will always happens when I put in reverse and start to release the clutch without touching the accelerator. The moment when revs needle drops slightly below idle speed all errors will appear temp gauge jump to top and revs counter drop to zero.
Then when stop and try to start the engine is just clicking sound

The only place I can see common connections to these driver display / functions is in the common earthing points.

https://www.freel2.com/gallery/albums/user...TS_LHD.pdf

Otherwise I cannot think of why these different functions shoud be interconnecting.

The only other thing would be a common control box power supply, which I can't see.

Trace / Have a look at your earthing. FL2 XS SD4 Auto 2010 2012-2017 (21k - 91k miles) (MY2011)
FL2 Metropolis SD4 Auto 2014 2017- (16k - 76k+ miles) (MY2015)

Thanks for diagrams. Looks like the all ground wires from the components inside the cabin are going to body control module. I had a look but I can't see any earth coming out or attached do bulkhead. I there any earth point inside cabin or earth is going to ecu?

My recommendation is to change the following first

And if this doesn't work then start looking for the grounding points as Ian pointed out.

Note: the location is the fuse box next to the battery in the engine compartment

Replace Relay R2 - Large Gray relay

Reason: R2 powers F11, F8, F6, F9, F12, F14, F1

F11 - Glow plugs low power

F8 - Throttle

F1 - Also for Glow plug low power


Here is the under side of the lid for the fuse box in the engine compartment

If it we me the first thing I would do is swap R2 (Glow plugs etc.) and R6 (the defroster)

If your problems goes away and the defroster is intermittent after the swap than buy a new relay





Here is a picture of the fuse box, R2 is only partly visible its the lower gray relay on the left




For me personally I did the following

- At 50,000 miles I replaced all of the fuses and relays and I've had no problems since

I did this for two reasons. First when the original battery died one of the Relays in the box shown above cycled on and off until the battery voltage dropped to a few volts, it was clicking for at least 30 minutes, thousands of cycles. I didn't know which relay was the problem so I replaced all of them. And for the fuses mine were corroded and I was concerned that they would not make good contact and that I would get electrical gremlins just like you are having.


Let us know how this works out


Good Luck

Paul

Here is a better picture showing R2

Click image to enlarge

Click image to enlarge

Thank you Paul for photos. I done as you asked, disconnected battery, swapped relays, removed all fuses one by one from all 3 boxes (all clean and dry) and again disconnected and reconnected 3 plugs in junction box. No change, still errors, not even click.
Just to add, first time this happened back in August on motorway after driving on ac in hot day after heavy rain. Temp jumped up and down, revs dropped to zero. I pulled on the side, switched off the engine, tried to start again, just click. Locked car for 5 minutes, car started. I was on holiday so I couldn't go to the dealer. I could clear the problem just by locking the car for 10, 15 min. Not anymore.

this is almost certainly an earthing problem,confirmed by the clicking when attempting to start,also I suspect when reverse is engaged the reverse lights are taking the avalible earth,killing the engine.ive had this on a focus.when the starter clicks a volt drop test from engine to body needs to be taken.to confirm this.adding extra earths anywhere from body to engine will also confirm this.a basic volt drop test on the terminals of the battery and all the positive supply cables will also help,its the old saying think simple first.ive known skilled mechanics condem ecu,s only for me to find supply voltage below 11.5 volts causing allsorts of strange problems.good luck and keep us informed

A bad relay would have been a nice easy fix.

Time to move on to the hard solutions.


Am I reading your post correctly if you push the start button then the engine doesn't crank at all?

I recommend that you get some baseline measurements

1. what is the voltage at the battery?

2. what is the voltage at the starter? (Main connection)

3. what is the voltage in the fuse box next to the battery (silver nut attached to large red wire in the picture I posted)

4. when you try to start what is the voltage at the starter solenoid?

5. if you dock the key and don't depress the clutch or the brake and press start button does the Nav/Radio turn on?


One last thought do you know if your Land Rover will start in neutral if you are not depressing the clutch? Mines an automatic so I don't know how the interlocks work on the manual transmission.


Good luck

Paul