To Sandy, See Ebay item no eBay Item No. 142423565415 for the drain plug tool

Mmm,I follow your drift,but could the same be said for the Toyota t-1v and the ford wss-m2c924-a,how can we tell if they are identical ? I guess we will never know.
I will phone smith n Allan and and ask the question. gone
P38 v8 auto no problems,great howle from exhausts when giving it welly
Td5 auto head gasket,no5 pot not uncommon but good car.
1st Tdv6s manual epb problem fixed under warranty(stealer said"never heard of this before,i suggested he looked at d3 forum.
2nd Tdv6 se auto epb
3rd Tdv6 xs auto 2008,swmbo,s favourite.

Those requirements were quoted exactly from the can of Mobil 3309 I have.

Bob 10MY (Sept 09) TD4 HSE Auto in Stornoway Grey (Now Gone)

08 FL2 TD4 SE Manual in Rimini Red (Now Gone)

Hi Bob
I will mention those numbers when I talk to them.
Sandy gone
P38 v8 auto no problems,great howle from exhausts when giving it welly
Td5 auto head gasket,no5 pot not uncommon but good car.
1st Tdv6s manual epb problem fixed under warranty(stealer said"never heard of this before,i suggested he looked at d3 forum.
2nd Tdv6 se auto epb
3rd Tdv6 xs auto 2008,swmbo,s favourite.

Their answer and dunkley201's comment about the "woolly" answer are both right in my opinion.
Indeed the oil formulations are secret among oil companies.
But the common thing that they must meet are the norms. Like ATF3309, ATF3324, ATF320, ATF220, etc.
And on those norms, the characteristics of the oils are quite well defined: the lubricity factor, the breaking point, the "grip" factor in case of the automatic fluids, etc.
As long as all parameters are met, then the oil will be good for the purpose.
This is why some oils are considered/advertised as "universal" oils that meet different norms, because they perform as they should for all conditions defined by those norms. They pass all tests for all specified norms.
But....
I prefer to use the correct norm and a fluid that meets only that norm - in our case ATF3309/T-IV up to MY2011, ATF3324 after MY2011 - because an universal fluid, in order to meet all specifications could have certain additives that wont agree with some of the materials used in a certain applications/autoboxes.
Just like GL4 and GL5 oils used on gearboxes or transfer cases. GL5 meets the requirements of GL4, but some additives on GL5 could damage in time the brass synchronizers used in manual gearboxes. So only GL4 on the manual gearbox and GL5 on differentials and transfer cases.
The same here: the correct and only fluid/norm/specification specified by the manufacturer of the automatic gearbox, because he knows for sure what's compatible with his design and used materials.

Thanks for the explanation Alex,so am I on the right line of thought that the gearbox manufacturer will inform the different manufacturers of the correct specification of the fluid,and its makeup details ie atf3309,then they will produce it to the said formula. gone
P38 v8 auto no problems,great howle from exhausts when giving it welly
Td5 auto head gasket,no5 pot not uncommon but good car.
1st Tdv6s manual epb problem fixed under warranty(stealer said"never heard of this before,i suggested he looked at d3 forum.
2nd Tdv6 se auto epb
3rd Tdv6 xs auto 2008,swmbo,s favourite.

dondiddy wrote:

To Sandy, See Ebay item no eBay Item No. 142423565415 for the drain plug tool

cheers dondiddy,just bought their last one
Cheers
Sandy
 gone
P38 v8 auto no problems,great howle from exhausts when giving it welly
Td5 auto head gasket,no5 pot not uncommon but good car.
1st Tdv6s manual epb problem fixed under warranty(stealer said"never heard of this before,i suggested he looked at d3 forum.
2nd Tdv6 se auto epb
3rd Tdv6 xs auto 2008,swmbo,s favourite.

Just had this reply from Glenn Bainbridge,ref ATF3309
Alex,what do you think,I emailed him yesterday and asked when an auto box manufacturer designs a new unit,they then instruct the various oil companies of the exact composition they need to be able to sell it as (Ie)ATF3309.
It seems to me that Smith and Allan must meet this requirement to be able to label it as such.
Sandy





RE: Atf3309
GB
Glenn Bainbridge <GlennBainbridge>
Mon 12/02/2018 15:58
Inbox
To:
thegaits@hotmail.com;
Hi Sandy,
Apologies the reply was not intended to be "woolley", I find it false to claim that a fluid will be identical to the next in terms of exact formulation and composition, when we know that it most likely isn't. In terms of will the fluid offer equivalent performance?, which is probably a far better way of terming this, then the answer is indeed yes.
It is fully synthetic on high quality, virgin base stocks, which inherently offer excellent cold temperature performance as well as resistance to oxidation, as is to be expected of a long term fluid of this nature.
It contains the correct frictional properties to promote quiet and smooth operation, as well as favourable wear protection, with favourable (FZG Failure Load Stage 150ºC - ASTM D5182M & (Four-ball scar diameter (40 kg 600rpm 150C 2h) - ASTM D4172
Other points to note are the fluids low tendency to foam with minimal foam after blowing and no foam after settling across 3 sequences. High quality base fluid and additives offer a low shearing formulation, again very important for ATF's and in particular those intended for long term services.
To summarise we have supplied this to date, to over 260 individual customers nationwide, just through the ebay market alone (of course nowhere near Mobil's or Fuchs global numbers I'm sure) with no short comings of the fluid reported. Given the acute nature of the fluid and it been a specific requirement it is highly likely most of these purchases have occurred where ATF 3309 is called for or been recommended specifically.
Regards

Glenn Bainbridge
Smith & Allan
Valley Street
Darlington
County Durham
DL1 1QE

Email glennbainbridge@smithandallan.com
Tel 01325 462 228
Fax 01325 368 122
Web www.smithandallan.com








Smith & Allan are one of the UK's largest independent lubricant manufacturers. Our specialities include lubricants for Industrial, Agricultural and Automotive sectors as well as many more.

We also provide industrial paints for many applications - Speak to a member of the team who will be more than happy to help. gone
P38 v8 auto no problems,great howle from exhausts when giving it welly
Td5 auto head gasket,no5 pot not uncommon but good car.
1st Tdv6s manual epb problem fixed under warranty(stealer said"never heard of this before,i suggested he looked at d3 forum.
2nd Tdv6 se auto epb
3rd Tdv6 xs auto 2008,swmbo,s favourite.

What is to think ?....
It seems a company that stand by and know their products and only time will tell if you will use their fluid and something will be wrong. And I am not saying that will be.
I know, it isn't the answer you expect, but nobody can give you assurances.

In fact, like I've said for other serviceable items as well, no offense, but people tend to talk around issues and things, when there should be no talking about.
They drive a car that costs 20-30,000 pounds, put inside the fuel tank in average 100 pounds on a fill up, but get indecisive about things that really mater to be o good quality.
What should I buy:
- a timing belt that costs 100 pounds, one that costs 80 pounds or one that costs 65 ? 20 pounds economy...
- an oil that is 10 pounds per liter or one that is 6 pounds per liter ? 4 pounds economy...
- a brake disk that cost 30 pounds or one that costs 20 pounds ? 10 pounds economy...
All of the above are items that matter and must be of good quality, otherwise you car, or worse - your life, can be in jeopardy !
Hellooooooo !!!
They "cheap" around 50-100 pounds, on service items that are required once every year and/or tens of thousands of miles and worth no more than a tank full of fuel !
How many tank fulls they use on one year and/or 10000 miles?
Can't they spare the cash for one more tank and buy high quality and verified service items?

Again, I am speaking generally and I don't want to be offensive.
Also I am not saying that their products aren't high quality. Maybe they are better than Mobil's or Castrol's or so.
And I can't say if it's OK or not without testing them.

Therefore, the issue is, like on anything, down to do the following:
Do you want to play guinea pig, save some quids and try their products or not?
Maybe they are much better than others and you will be doing a whole of good for you, them and for all of us.
Or maybe....

hi Alex
Thanks for the reply,no offence taken,as you put it is it worth saving a few pounds against what the outcome might or might not be(anyone got a crystal ball handy)who knows what the answer is,this is why I bought it up in the first place,just looking for some sound advice on something which could poss save a lot of money for a lot of people.
The situation might well have been the opposite if S/A was the norm and other manufacturers came one the market with what would in theory be the "same"product.
I have looked up the product on eBay as dunkley201 mentioned and t does in fact Match the Toyota t-1V spec.
Thank for your valued input.
Sandy  gone
P38 v8 auto no problems,great howle from exhausts when giving it welly
Td5 auto head gasket,no5 pot not uncommon but good car.
1st Tdv6s manual epb problem fixed under warranty(stealer said"never heard of this before,i suggested he looked at d3 forum.
2nd Tdv6 se auto epb
3rd Tdv6 xs auto 2008,swmbo,s favourite.

My fully serviced 2008 is due its autobox oil change this coming service, my local garage here in Spain has asked me to get the ATF as he doesn't carry it.
Whilst searching I have found this.:- PEMCO iMATIC 450 ATF

It is JWS 3309, has anyone used it? Seems cheap, I can get 10x1 litre bottles, delivered to Spain from Germany for €40!

Or this for €26 for 4l MANNOL Dexron III Automatic Plus

Hi Spaniard
there are many opinions on here ref which ATF manufacturer to use,the well know branded names are generally very expensive
probably in part to their huge costs and advertising campaigns etc

This is why I checked out smaller manufacturers of the product,ie SMITH AND ALLAN.they have manufactured oil,s and fluids
since the 1920,s,i spoke to their tech dept and was assured in writing that their product does meet the requirements of ATF3309.at half the cost of most so called top brands.
I bought the fluid early last year and did the dump and fill method (as did a friend down the road a month later)and all is well,both "box,s" are definitly smoother as a result.
Only use ATF3309,nothing else,do a bit of research on any suppliers you find also look for an actuall manufacterer.

good luck
sandy
 gone
P38 v8 auto no problems,great howle from exhausts when giving it welly
Td5 auto head gasket,no5 pot not uncommon but good car.
1st Tdv6s manual epb problem fixed under warranty(stealer said"never heard of this before,i suggested he looked at d3 forum.
2nd Tdv6 se auto epb
3rd Tdv6 xs auto 2008,swmbo,s favourite.

I don’t think it’s worth the risk to use alternative fluids. Stick to what the manufacturer suggests. I had similar thoughts a while ago but after much reading (mostly on this wonderful forum) I decided to pay the extra for the Mobil 3309.

In the end, this is a very expensive gearbox. If you’re doing it yourself, you’re still saving a ton vs taking it to a garage anyway, even if you have to buy a set of tools. Not to mention you know exactly what’s being used.

I've bit the bullet and ordered 10 litres of the Pemco.
I'll post results after the service, due in April.

If you have a MY 2010 or above I have just found this that meets ATF 3324 specifications

https://www.jgs4x4.co.uk/top-tec-atf-1800-...moly-3687/
Or this